The Official Machinae Supremacy Forum

General => Random => Topic started by: limBer on October 04, 2006, 08:26:28 am

Title: Are elves...
Post by: limBer on October 04, 2006, 08:26:28 am
... related to fairies in any way? Same question for gnomes as well.
Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: PrescriptiveBarony on October 04, 2006, 10:23:27 am
Gnomes are lawn decorations.

Elves have long ears, but that's the only thing that is agreed upon by the trillions of different incarnations of elves.

Fairies replenish all life and can live indefinitely in bottles.
Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: Torp v2.0 on October 04, 2006, 04:17:54 pm
Depends on who you ask.

Elves are an old germanic race supernatural beings or demi-gods. They feature in norse mythology, and are generally considered humanoids of great beauty. I'm quite unsure as to whether or not the old sources have any references to elves having long ears, but am inclined to believe that they don't, until such a proof can be found. It was these older sources, and not the early modern sources (that is, the 18th century and later) of the small, mischiveous ones, that Tolkien used as a base for his elves, which today is what we think of when we hear the word elf.

As with the small, mischiveous elves, the tiny winged fairies did not show up until the early modern period. Before that, they ranged quite a lot in apperance and kind, and the supernatural entities of Faerie in Neil Gaimans Sandman might be better examples of the "original" fae. I believe the fae to have come from south-western Europe, though they may just as well have been a corruption of the germanic fae that travelled to England through France.

So, the conclusion: I don't know. The two came to England, where they melted together, from very different sources, but that doesn't mean the sources of the sources of the sources weren't the same. I would not suppose they were originally related, apart from the fact that they both could possess some common traits (human-sized humanoids of above-average beauty).

Gnomes are Earth Elementals from alchemy, I've heard.

Fairies and elves became similar creatures as they
Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: Outboundlight on October 04, 2006, 05:56:15 pm
this thread is soooo rascist
Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: Asor on October 04, 2006, 07:03:57 pm
Depends on who you ask.

Elves are an old germanic race supernatural beings or demi-gods. They feature in norse mythology, and are generally considered humanoids of great beauty. I'm quite unsure as to whether or not the old sources have any references to elves having long ears, but am inclined to believe that they don't, until such a proof can be found. It was these older sources, and not the early modern sources (that is, the 18th century and later) of the small, mischiveous ones, that Tolkien used as a base for his elves, which today is what we think of when we hear the word elf.

As with the small, mischiveous elves, the tiny winged fairies did not show up until the early modern period. Before that, they ranged quite a lot in apperance and kind, and the supernatural entities of Faerie in Neil Gaimans Sandman might be better examples of the "original" fae. I believe the fae to have come from south-western Europe, though they may just as well have been a corruption of the germanic fae that travelled to England through France.

So, the conclusion: I don't know. The two came to England, where they melted together, from very different sources, but that doesn't mean the sources of the sources of the sources weren't the same. I would not suppose they were originally related, apart from the fact that they both could possess some common traits (human-sized humanoids of above-average beauty).

Gnomes are Earth Elementals from alchemy, I've heard.

Fairies and elves became similar creatures as they
In finnish stories elves are usually beings that are smaller than human, but they posses god-like powers within their area of influence. Most elves guard or protect some area or something, like forest-elf, house-elf and so on. Some stories mix elves and gnomes with each other, forming the finnish traditional "tonttu", which are Santa's legendary helpers.
But yeah, I dont really have enough time to say more stuff, but im sure once Gravehill comes this way he will wtfpwn you guys with finnish elf-stuff.

Dont know much about how they are seen in other countries, but historical Finland elves were both feared and worshipped by the folks.
Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: harvey danger on October 04, 2006, 08:55:13 pm
this thread is soooo rascist

Go back to Nepal.  >:(
Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: Bates on October 04, 2006, 11:22:39 pm
PANEL

holy macaroni cross over post.
Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: evilcandybag on October 05, 2006, 12:02:58 am
As with the small, mischiveous elves, the tiny winged fairies did not show up until the early modern period. Before that, they ranged quite a lot in apperance and kind, and the supernatural entities of Faerie in Neil Gaimans Sandman might be better examples of the "original" fae. I believe the fae to have come from south-western Europe, though they may just as well have been a corruption of the germanic fae that travelled to England through France.

Actually, faeries trace farther back than the normans. The realm of Faerie (most probably a modern adaptation of the word) and it's inhabitants are for example described in the Celtic religious tradition, collected in a book called the Mabinogion (or Mabinogi). For example, in the book, one of the kings of Dyved (Pwyll or Pryderi, I don't know which) enters a cursed grave mound (with tombs attached) and comes to the land of Faerie.
In the Mabinogion, the realm of Faerie is one of several different planes between which souls wander between lives.
Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: Bates on October 05, 2006, 12:05:03 am
like those wisps in Oblivion that are quite hard to kill
Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: WereVolvo on October 05, 2006, 02:48:59 am
don't even mention those fucking things... I hate it when they manage to hit me and inevitably drain my willpower

/me goes into a murderous rage and annihilates everything that looks even remotely like a wisp
Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: Torp v2.0 on October 05, 2006, 02:10:51 pm
As with the small, mischiveous elves, the tiny winged fairies did not show up until the early modern period. Before that, they ranged quite a lot in apperance and kind, and the supernatural entities of Faerie in Neil Gaimans Sandman might be better examples of the "original" fae. I believe the fae to have come from south-western Europe, though they may just as well have been a corruption of the germanic fae that travelled to England through France.

Actually, faeries trace farther back than the normans. The realm of Faerie (most probably a modern adaptation of the word) and it's inhabitants are for example described in the Celtic religious tradition, collected in a book called the Mabinogion (or Mabinogi). For example, in the book, one of the kings of Dyved (Pwyll or Pryderi, I don't know which) enters a cursed grave mound (with tombs attached) and comes to the land of Faerie.
In the Mabinogion, the realm of Faerie is one of several different planes between which souls wander between lives.

Okay, I suppose I missed the celtic connection. I based my supposition that the faeries came from south-western Europe on the fact that the word faerie has etymologic connections with the latin-based languages. Of course, it might have entered the language during the time of the Roman empire, and the fact that the word comes from some place does not mean that the creatures come from the same.
Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: evilcandybag on October 06, 2006, 01:07:24 am
As with the small, mischiveous elves, the tiny winged fairies did not show up until the early modern period. Before that, they ranged quite a lot in apperance and kind, and the supernatural entities of Faerie in Neil Gaimans Sandman might be better examples of the "original" fae. I believe the fae to have come from south-western Europe, though they may just as well have been a corruption of the germanic fae that travelled to England through France.

Actually, faeries trace farther back than the normans. The realm of Faerie (most probably a modern adaptation of the word) and it's inhabitants are for example described in the Celtic religious tradition, collected in a book called the Mabinogion (or Mabinogi). For example, in the book, one of the kings of Dyved (Pwyll or Pryderi, I don't know which) enters a cursed grave mound (with tombs attached) and comes to the land of Faerie.
In the Mabinogion, the realm of Faerie is one of several different planes between which souls wander between lives.

Okay, I suppose I missed the celtic connection. I based my supposition that the faeries came from south-western Europe on the fact that the word faerie has etymologic connections with the latin-based languages. Of course, it might have entered the language during the time of the Roman empire, and the fact that the word comes from some place does not mean that the creatures come from the same.

Since most scriptures describing pre-christian traditions were compiled and written down by monks, the actual Celtic word for faeries may have been translated to the Latin equivalent.

Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: Outboundlight on October 06, 2006, 06:39:11 pm
The irish aren't too be trusted anyway
Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: Ant on October 07, 2006, 03:01:48 am
The irish aren't too be trusted anyway

QFT!
Title: Re: Are elves...
Post by: MDX on October 11, 2006, 06:25:41 pm
this thread is soooo rascist

Go back to Nepal.  >:(

what the fuck did you just say? VT, get the bat, no no the bigger bat, THE BIGGER BAT.. ffs ill get it.