Mascircumcision

[Ant]

Watching the news before I went to bed last night and saw in the scrolling overview of the news about how the African government wants a mass circumcision for the whole continent as it's thought to help prevent the spread of AIDs.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/aids/story/0,,2045119,00.html There's a link for ye

My condolences are with Africa

[Lexx]

Cor. Now to convince people to immigrate..

[Outboundlight]

This is up there with the Catholic church's "Condoms give you aids" propoganda...

[Ant]

Well it seems science have proven it improves chances of NOT contracting AIDs by up to 60%, which is a good thing I guess

[Gravehill]

Never mind AIDS... Penis (or genitalia in general) is very personal thing and each individual should have personal right to choose what to do with their penis. If such order were given in Finland I would fight for my sons or my own right to have his/mine penis intact.

[Lysix]

Yes, but in finland you're not all dieing from AIDS. It's a different matter altogether

[Ant]

When you have an epidemic spreading across the world, it's almost impossible to completely get rid of it. Unless! You go straight for where it is most concentrated, that way, you take out a large proportion of it and also where it possibly began.

[Gravehill]

Yes, but in finland you're not all dieing from AIDS. It's a different matter altogether

My main concern is that this "patent solution" is causing more problems than it solves. Who can quarantee that those studies are not done by someone who has religious or other hidden agendas? For example Jewish doctors have worked for years to proof that circumcision is healthy procedure. Countless studies have been made and later found out as invalid.

Also, people do come more careless when they believe that it protects from AIDS. They have even more nonsafe sex with strangers. Now... Let's assume that it really gives 60% protection. What about those 40% who think they are safe but in the matter of fact are not? Also, circumcision is practice in quite many areas in Africa already and they still do have AIDS problem. I would not want entire continent to fall as guinea pig...

Circumcision is quite dangerous procedure - there's high risk of infection during that procedure. Not many years ago large number of babies did have dangerous infections because underground doctor made some operations in non-clinic environment. This happened here in my own hometown. People have gotten AIDS from blood transfusions and other medical procedures in Africa when non-sterile, used equipment were used in procedures. I can't think how mascircumcision would work other way... Risks are too high.

AIDS spreads because a) people don't know b) people don't care. You can educate people which reduces amount of people who don't know about it. With education and improved life status people start to care more. Also, changing social and cultural habits lowers risks.

I also would point out that it's not entirely different matter alltogether whether you live in Africa or in Finland. Risk exists even here in Finland. Not just AIDS but dozens of other venereal diseases. Just that pattern of thought "it's not that big problem here or there" helps it to grow so that it actually is. No matter what the situation is or where you live there's always people who live risk life and spread those diseases. I won't help my son by cutting his penis but telling him how to use it properly and with low risk. If he cares about his partner and his own health he would learn to be responsible and to know how to safe sex.

[Lysix]

You missed my point. I'm aware circumcision is a bullshit idea, but the way you stated your argument was as if finland is the same as a 3rd world country.

[Jack Lupino]

When i read the thread name it made me think about a sexual disease. Honest !

[Gravehill]

You missed my point. I'm aware circumcision is a bullshit idea, but the way you stated your argument was as if finland is the same as a 3rd world country.

3rd world country or Finland... The difference ain't so big. People are just people. They eat, drink and fuck, what ever they can. And because they do so (fuck) AIDS spreads. If people just thought twice before putting their willies in every hole possible there were less trouble and less AIDS.

If they implement that great universal fix for AIDS problem in Africa how long it takes when they make it mandatory all around world? Really... Doctors are easy mannequins for new drugs or treatments. Treat them some food, give them some guru to lecture and some "hard facts" or "convincing results" and they do as you say. Few doctors really check facts. And it takes awfully many of those fews to get enough counter evidence so that truth is under more suspicion. Those "tobacco is healthy" surveys are just one example of this thing Most people believes what ever that guy in white jacket tells them. They buy the medicine, they get botox, they cut off their foreskin. Medical opinions become base for laws and standards pretty easily. Like different vaccination programs. Don't get me wrong, I think that they are (mostly) good thing. If circumcision becomes vaccination for AIDS that's one shot I don't want to get.

Thinking that some 3rd world countries are so filled with people who can't use their willies right is imperialistic. They could be responsible, they could manage AIDS as well (or badly) as western countries are doing if they could get just as much education, other fun things to do (beside fucking) and as affordable condoms as we do. Most of them just don't know enough or just don't care - latter one causing practically every AIDS case in western countries.

I would also like to point out that I said "If such order were given in Finland" simply because I'm living in Finland and not in some African country. Sure, I would fight for my foreskin if I were living in Africa as well (with this knowledge and all) but I don't live there.

[Lysix]

3rd world country or Finland... The difference ain't so big.

I stopped reading there because thats just lol.

[Ant]

I don't mind Gravy, free drugs

[Gravehill]

3rd world country or Finland... The difference ain't so big.

I stopped reading there because thats just lol.

When you really think how humans live their life there is no real difference. We eat and defecate, drink and urinate, mature and have sex. Sex is one of basic needs in human life. Urge to fill that need is so strong that it drives people even to risk behaviour... And thus helps spreading of AIDS. That urge is universal and quite as strong everywhere. Finland, Africa... There really ain't real difference.

[harvey danger]

3rd world country or Finland... The difference ain't so big.

I stopped reading there because thats just lol.

When you really think how humans live their life there is no real difference. We eat and defecate, drink and urinate, mature and have sex. Sex is one of basic needs in human life. Urge to fill that need is so strong that it drives people even to risk behaviour... And thus helps spreading of AIDS. That urge is universal and quite as strong everywhere. Finland, Africa... There really ain't real difference.

Organizations try to educate Africans, though. I can't say how effective it is; there are currently several campaigns in the US, and I don't know what their statistics are. The problem comes with the fact that Africa is just a mess right now. Partly by westerners' fault and partly by their own. It's hard to educate people against AIDS when there is no standing government or when women are being raped regularly in a war-torn country like Sudan. I doubt the "mass-circumcision" would ever be fully put into effect, anyways, because half of the countries in Africa either wouldn't know or wouldn't care about it.